Cobra Jet MAF & Cobra Jet Throttle Body

[BEEKAY GT500]

Originally Posted by Blackshelby

At the present time I do not want to post any dyno graphs until all is completed and in production.(But I can tell you the post from 68fastback his graphs are very close to what has been seen in testing)
Throttle response can change/improve some from/by the design of the TB itself. If the TB offers increased air velocity, some improvement with the Throttle response will be felt. (but otherwise I would not expect any increase in throttle response) Another example would be a TB with poor air velocity at low speeds would decrease Throttle response(this usually is a design issue with large single blade tb's )
If you went into the program there are many maps that control the Throttle Body and Throttle response-- dashpots, idle control, torque tables, air flow tables effective throttle air tables, trans fuel, spark etc. but the main one that would increase throttle response would be called ETC DRIVER DEMAND INPUT. This table has the greatest effect on how fast or slow the blades will open when you press on the gas pedal.
When I say a tune is not needed you can bolt the TB on and go. No failsafe not wrench light , NO IDLE ISSUES, NO DRIVABILITY issues.etc.
A tune can improve throttle response, power and many other parameters.Its just nice to know you don't need one unless you want one.
Even with no tune the CJ TB offers increased HP with all else being equal to the stock TB and its characteristics.

thanks. no problem on the sheets. i am assuming you need the sct tuner software (or other brand equivalent) to make these changes since i cannot make these kind of adjustments with the xcal2. in your opinion why would a tune be setup with a less agressive throttle response at tip in? i'm starting to think that maybe it is setup this way to make it easier to launch. btw, don't forget to get your tvs sheets up on the other site .

[esc]

Does anyone know if the M-6316-CJ is the stock diameter or has it got the 10% reduction for more boost? Thanks

[Birdman]

Originally Posted by esc

Does anyone know if the M-6316-CJ is the stock diameter or has it got the 10% reduction for more boost? Thanks

The 6316 is the CJ / innovators west harmonic balancer /Ford and it is 8" dia (10% larger) compared to the 7" stock balancer.

[esc]

Does it come with a new belt?

[Birdman]

Originally Posted by esc

Does it come with a new belt?

Not that I know of.

[SLGT750]

Just being curious the other day I went ahead and measured the different TB's I've have.

Stock - 59.89mm

CJ - 63.28mm

VMP's 67mm - 66.80mm

I was measuring the bore and not the blades, not sure if this is the correct way to measure but it looks the CJ is closer to a 63.5 than a 62.5.

[68fastback]

Originally Posted by SLGT750

Just being curious the other day I went ahead and measured the different TB's I've have.

Stock - 59.89mm

CJ - 63.28mm

VMP's 67mm - 66.80mm

I was measuring the bore and not the blades, not sure if this is the correct way to measure but it looks the CJ is closer to a 63.5 than a 62.5.

You have one fine collection ;-) and we know the 160mono measures 147

...and the super-slippery no-name (twin-66?) is still coming!

[ ....and will outflow them all . . . ]

[Brian Z.]

Originally Posted by Blackshelby

Here are the pictures I promised.
Sorry for the delays
Flow work was done with the filter and inlet tube on the MAF and off.
The only item that was found to be a restriction was the air filter (one in picture on the 113 ford cai). That filter started to have a pressure drop around 2300-2400kg. When replace with filter in the picture on the new MAF, there was almost zero pressure. All flow testing was taken up to 3200kg which equals 1600cfm or enough air to support 1066HP.
I will be testing the new MAF on the dyno against the ford 113. Will also be testing Ford's new TB(I am expecting to be on the dyno in a week or two)
Will post result when completed.

Blackshelby do you mind telling me where you got the 2nd air filter that is pictured? I just picked up a the cj 123mm maf and would like to try that filter with it. Thanks.

[Blackshelby]

Originally Posted by Brian Z.

Blackshelby do you mind telling me where you got the 2nd air filter that is pictured? I just picked up a the cj 123mm maf and would like to try that filter with it. Thanks.

Its a S&B filter part # R0927

[Brian Z.]

Great - thanks very much for looking that up for me. I'm thinking of using that on the dyno and when I go to the track and using the one that came with my ford cai kit for daily driving purposes, which is what I used to do with my procharged cobra years ago. I always wondered about the restriction from the filter and your test proved that there was one which was very helpful info.

[Brian Z.]

Okay - dumb question. I picked up a new CJ throttle body and CJ 123mm maf cheap (was going to get the L&M TB after hearing so many good results with it but the deal on the cj was too good to pass on). I currently have the ford cai and 113 mm maf. Do I simply swap the maf sensor off my current maf or do I need to order a maf sensor for the 123? I noticed the cj 123 maf kit calls for a Ford GT maf sensor (4G7Z-12B579-AB) but I didn't get the kit, just the maf tube. Thanks.

[gr8snkbite]

Originally Posted by Brian Z.

Okay - dumb question. I picked up a new CJ throttle body and CJ 123mm maf cheap (was going to get the L&M TB after hearing so many good results with it but the deal on the cj was too good to pass on). I currently have the ford cai and 113 mm maf. Do I simply swap the maf sensor off my current maf or do I need to order a maf sensor for the 123? I noticed the cj 123 maf kit calls for a Ford GT maf sensor (4G7Z-12B579-AB) but I didn't get the kit, just the maf tube. Thanks.

you'll want to get the HPX Maf sensor joe sells in the store. it'll give you more range to work with in the tune. It also fits in the stock location.

[Joe G]

Keith - won't the tune need to be adjusted to the new MAF size (and the HPX if he uses it) too??


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[gr8snkbite]

Originally Posted by Joe G

Keith - won't the tune need to be adjusted to the new MAF size (and the HPX if he uses it) too??


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yes, using the CJ Maf he will need to have the tune adj, which is why i recommend the HPX. Not to mention the TB.

[Brian Z.]

Thanks for the replies. I am getting a new tune in the spring (car is up for the winter) since I'm also adding 60lb injectors. I'll check out the hpx maf sensor.

[gr8snkbite]

Originally Posted by Brian Z.

Thanks for the replies. I am getting a new tune in the spring (car is up for the winter) since I'm also adding 60lb injectors. I'll check out the hpx maf sensor.

you'll be better off with it..provides a greater range to work with and not have to worry about being limited..

[Joe G]

Originally Posted by gr8snkbite

yes, using the CJ Maf he will need to have the tune adj, which is why i recommend the HPX. Not to mention the TB.

Thanks. Just trying to make sure I (and others) understood 100%.


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[68fastback]

Originally Posted by Joe G

Thanks. Just trying to make sure I (and others) understood 100%.


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Will need the right meter curve in the tune just to drive it since even the stock sensor ported from the stock MAF to the CJ MAF will tell the PCM that much less air is flowing than actually is and it will go lean.

The tuner (person) should be able to provide a tune just for porting the sensor to the CJ MAF. He'll need to know the sensor (stock or HPX) and the tube diameter and he can then look up the curve data. Once that's done you can safely drive to the tuner.

I suspect there are a few folks on here who have the curve data for the HPX in the 123 CJ MAF. Dunno if it can be done with a handheld tuner or not but a modified tune from the tuner (human) can be e-mailed and loaded that way.

[iceman]

Maybe one of you smart guys could talk about the options here with regard to the MAF? I have mine with the old set up from before a wider range MAF was available using the Mafia (not StangMafia) to trick the system and while I know it's not the ideal set up it has worked with out issue for 2+ years with my KB set up.

thanks in advance smart guys (and Bill)

[gr8snkbite]

Originally Posted by iceman

Maybe one of you smart guys could talk about the options here with regard to the MAF? I have mine with the old set up from before a wider range MAF was available using the Mafia (not StangMafia) to trick the system and while I know it's not the ideal set up it has worked with out issue for 2+ years with my KB set up.

thanks in advance smart guys (and Bill)

get the HPX. It's range is increased just for this reason, to prevent maxing your limitations based on mods. Looks like and fits in the stock location. Doesnt trick the system. Nothing else out there.